| F1205 |
The first question, er, is to you, [CENSORED: forename]. Where are you from originally? |
| F1206 |
Er, I'm from Poland. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. Where in Poland? |
| F1206 |
Er, so I was born in the centre of Poland, but I studied er in Wrocław, which is a town in the south-west of Poland. |
| F1205 |
So that erm place where you were born, is it a small town? |
| F1206 |
Yeah, it's a village.
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1205 |
//So wh-how old were you when you moved?// |
| F1206 |
Finally, fifteen because also er when I went er to secondary school er I lived in student halls, something? [?]Rezydencja[/?]?
Something like that, already. And after that I lived a year in Paris, and after that I come back er to Poland to study at University in Wrocław. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
So how long have you lived in Glasgow? |
| F1206 |
Er so I've been living er here almost for three years, in March will be three years. |
| F1205 |
Okay, and what do you do here? |
| F1206 |
So at the moment er I'm studying English at college and I'm working in a food company as a production worker.
So I make er tortilla wraps.
//But I hope to find er// |
| F1205 |
//Okay.// |
| F1206 |
a better job er mm because in Poland I er work as er a French teacher,
//so maybe in the future// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
here I will find mm the same job,
//or maybe as a Polish teacher.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
Mmhm.
So how do you feel in Glasgow now that you work as a production worker and er not not as a teacher? Is that...? Do you feel okay with it? |
| F1206 |
Er at the beginning it was okay, er, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
a good experience, especially because in Poland when I... before I er living, I worked too much,
and I was a little tired, so it was a great break for me. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
But now it's not enough for me,
//so I would like to find a better job.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm mmhm.//
Do you think there's something special about you being Polish, er, do you think there's something special being a Polish woman in Glasgow? |
| F1206 |
Mm maybe not Polish but er foreign er woman,
because er that's, at the beginning er of course I had problems because of language.
When I came here I came without English at all, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
so that, it wasn't easy.
//Now it's better, much better, because I can communicate.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
Yeah. |
| F1205 |
So for how long would you say that you've learned English? Er, was it three years? |
| F1206 |
Er no finally it's the second year at college,
//and// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
er because I waited almost a year
er and I, before college, the college, I learned just a little at home
//myself.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
So how long do you think that would, if you had to sum up how-, what a what period of time it would be, you learning English, would it be... |
| F1206 |
Almo-, yeah, almost three years |
| F1205 |
Mmhm mmhm. |
| F1206 |
when I move here, yeah.
//[laugh]// |
| F1205 |
//That's that's very impressive. [laugh]//
Er, I think we can, we can move to a more general discussion of the
//role of women// |
| F1206 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1205 |
and the life of women in Glasgow.
And I would like you, [CENSORED: forename] to take part, er now.
Erm, the first thing I would like to ask you is er do you think the role of the woman in the family is different, in Scotland to to Poland, and [CENSORED: forename], I would like you to talk about your own experiences, |
| F1206 |
Mmhm. |
| F1205 |
and [CENSORED: forename], you about your observations. |
| F1206 |
Yes, I think it is a little different, er because it's er another culture, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
er different culture, so mm, in my opinion, Polish women are more traditional. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
The situation in Poland of course has changed er er but still er I think we can observe this er
//differences.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
Er for example at home, mm mm er Polish women cook more. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Er finally we started here to use ready meals. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Yeah, and er also erm about mm looking after children, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
er of course in Poland Polish women started to make career, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
er but mostly they are concentrated to look after the children,
//women, not men, still.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
Here er couples' relationships are er more mm equal, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
I think. It's a partnership. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. What do you think of that, is that true? |
| M1207 |
I think yes, it's it's true.
I could ask maybe, that [cough] it seems to me that there's not so close relationship between the youngsters and parents here
//as it is in Poland.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm oh yeah, mmhm.//
How how did you, ho-how did you observe that, er the relationship between...
//In the streets or? Mm.// |
| M1207 |
//Er just, maybe//
//my friends and and colleagues from the university.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
In Poland even if if we have er older friends than the people we st-study with
//the parents are the common subject of conversation. Here// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm yeah.// |
| M1207 |
no one really mentions the parents. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
If I just can think just for now,
//only// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
once my my my colleague from the uni mentioned parents when she said that she was given the car
//from from from her mother. That was it.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
In Poland people talk more about their parents, so I can guess from that that they have closer relationships.
//Also,// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
when I used to work with the the the working-class people, they are very keen to move out from the parents' house,
//even if they're sixteen they quit h-, they quit school,// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
leave [inaudible]. |
| F1206 |
Even on the street I think we can observe the children [inaudible], maybe because here, Glasgow is leave er a big town so
//it's a little different but on the street// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
even children er are mm very often impolite, er
//very noisy on the bus, that in Poland it's completely different.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//I mm I think in Poland children still have more respect to adults.// |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Of course we have a lot of problems in Poland, but it's a little better. |
| F1205 |
Do you think there's a difference between female and male children and their relationships? Wha-, do you think girls maybe are less [inaudible]...? |
| F1206 |
I heard that [inaudible] girls here are worse
//but, no. [laugh]// |
| F1205 |
//[laugh]// |
| M1207 |
I was reading in the article that it's... compared to Poland there's much, significantly more crime between the
//female youngsters than in Poland.// |
| F1205 |
//Uh-huh uh-huh.// |
| F1206 |
//Uh-huh.// |
| F1205 |
So what do you think about life in the family and er how duties and er chores, how they are distributed?
Do you think er children have the same responsibilities, female and male children?
Do you think they have any chores to do at all? Erm. |
| F1206 |
I think that depends on the family.
//Erm... [exhale]// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
What about men and women? Erm
//you you mentioned cooking.// |
| F1206 |
//That, I think that er, erm//
Polish model of the family it's still more traditional. It's er, er a role of er of women in the family it's more important. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Er she's responsible for cooking, for cleaning, er for looking after children,
er which I mentioned, er er of course that's changed, and also er women erm er do a career.
//But er I think still, this role, it's more traditional.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
Do you think that you have changed your attitude here
//towards equality,// |
| F1206 |
//Mm.//
//Not really, I don't know, because er here we started to live together// |
| F1205 |
//in that...?//
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
so it's different. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
//[laugh]// |
| F1206 |
//I don't know. [laugh]// |
| F1205 |
You mentioned cooking.
Er, have you changed your eating habits
//in Glasgow?// |
| F1206 |
//Yeah.//
//Er yeah, I think er because er we started to use these ready meals.// |
| F1205 |
//Yeah? Yeah. [laugh]// |
| F1206 |
The life, it's quicker here. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Er yeah but la- er lastly we came back to Polish traditional foods. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
//It's healthier.// |
| M1207 |
//I think also// |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
from the financ- financial reasons, the ready meals are much more affordable
//here, while// |
| F1205 |
//Yeah, uh-huh.// |
| M1207 |
there's not really much choice of the fresh fruits,
//it's really poor for vegetables and and some things like that.// |
| F1205 |
//That's true. Mmhm.//
//Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
//So that could be also a reason why we we change that habit.//
But now |
| F1206 |
But also about the food that I like very much, the possibility to try a new, completely new
//food, er// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//er like Indian, we try that and we love very much.// |
| F1205 |
What about erm work, you were talking about your work?
But on a more general level, do you think women here have more of an opportunity to work, or is it the same in Poland?
//Do you have maybe a better position at work?// |
| F1206 |
//So er//
here it's I think a little better, I'm not sure very well about er this aspect, this subject. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
//Maybe the place where you work?// |
| F1206 |
//Er...// |
| F1205 |
Wh- who are the managers? |
| F1206 |
Mm er the manager, yeah, it's a man, and the supervisor it's er a girl.
//So I don't know.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
But er mm lastly er er I spoke about, with my friends about er maternity holiday. |
| F1205 |
Uh-huh.
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Here it's better, much better than Poland,//
because the maternity holiday, leave, it's er longer. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Er and er even when they er, it finished you can receive er benefits here. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
In Poland it's not so easy.
//After four months// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//er you have to come back to work or live at home but without finan-finan-financial support.//
//So here it's easier.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm. Okay, yeah.// |
| M1207 |
I think there's er much more women are doing the jobs
//which are traditionally male jobs, like// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Uh-huh.// |
| M1207 |
er I I work with the police, there's plenty of female police officers, which is still arriving
//in Poland.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
There's plenty of lorry drivers
//erm// |
| F1206 |
//That's true, mmhm.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
//in Poland there's virtually no female lorry drivers, and//
bus drivers as well. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
So there is a lot of women who do the traditionally male jobs. |
| F1206 |
Yeah, in Poland still that is something strange. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
//Mmhm// |
| M1207 |
//I think it may be related to, like, [inaudible] reading an article about the female bus driver in in Wrocław.//
//And she was only able to start when they introduced the the new buses with power steering and so on, because on old Eastern European buses just it's not good enough for women,// |
| F1205 |
//mmhm.//
//Mmhm. [laugh] Yeah, yeah.// |
| M1207 |
//because you have to be really strong to be able to drive it.//
//[cough]// |
| F1205 |
//So [CENSORED: forename] do you see erm//
when you think about your future here in work, in ed- employment, do you see possibilities and opportunities? D-do you, how do you look at your future? |
| F1206 |
Yeah, I hope, mm but er er here at-, I had only three jobs, and it was simple jobs. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Mm but I hope in the future er I will come back to my profession. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Yep. |
| F1205 |
So are you not thinking of going back to Poland, do you not, you don't
//[inaudible]. Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Yes, one day of course, but//
or maybe to move to France, it's my dream.
//[laugh]// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm [laugh]//
Okay, er what about your free time?
How how did you spend free time in Poland?
What did you do on weekends, evenings? |
| F1206 |
Almost the same.
Er, go to the cinema. At the beginning it was not easy because I couldn't go to the cinema because of the language, problem with the language.
Er but not it's better.
Er, only I miss the theatre,
//mm because// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
the, of the problem with language, er it's n-, it's still not possible I think for me.
Er but a big difference is that here in Scotland young people, or not even young, in general people go to a pub, have a drink. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//And in Poland very often we organise a party at home.//
That is really specific and different.
Er and here it's a really important role of a a woman, because er usually it's she she prepares er everything, food,
//is a host of a house, so// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
that is completely different.
And here in Scotland, we we do both. We go to a pub but er sometimes also we invite people at home. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Even the Scottish friends to show// |
| M1207 |
//Or we go [inaudible].// |
| F1206 |
how we spend time to have er a pint of porridge beer, for example. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. Yeah, that's true.
And what about er the way you dress, has it changed
//since you got here?// |
| F1206 |
//Yeah, that's//
that's, when I came here, at the beginning it was er one of the first things er which I was surprised of,
er because the fashion is different I think.
Poland it's, the fashion in Poland it's er mostly European style,
and here it's American style. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
So girls, er, I think, er mm we're in informal style,
//mostly.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
The style, it's informal, a little more. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
As I'm serving myself and some of our friends, the most significant change is that after you start to eat Scottish food you need clothes two sizes
//bigger or something,// |
| F1205 |
//[laugh]// |
| F1206 |
//[laugh]// |
| M1207 |
because of this all unhealthy food and lack of of fresh vegetables and so on,
//and ready meals and fast foods and so on.// |
| F1205 |
//But wh-wh-? Mmhm mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
The the fast food takeaways are so much more affordable than in Poland, so people eat them more and you can see that in your belt. [laugh] |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
Would you say, when y-you're in the street, do you think women look different?
//Because obviously... not that you look at women all the time, but erm...// |
| M1207 |
//Mm yeah.// |
| F1205 |
But you must sometimes. |
| M1207 |
Yeah, they they look different, the way they they they [inaudible].
I think, if- I'm not a fashion specialist, but I can observe, women here are are, er, it seems to me if if she will see something on a display on the on the high street shop she will go and she will buy the whole set,
//you know, from the the top of the head to the bottom,// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
and you'll wea-wea-wear here.
//In Poland it seems to me the the women have more invention in in creating the the clothes.// |
| F1205 |
//Mm. [laugh]//
//Uh-huh.// |
| M1207 |
//And also//
//some some women seems to be er not aware that if something looks good in size eight it will still looks good in size twenty, and they are still wearing that, and I think that's the downside of of looking at the women here.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm. [laugh]//
//Do you think they spend more money on clothes here?// |
| M1207 |
//[cough]// |
| F1206 |
Yes, I think,
//huh.// |
| M1207 |
//But also it's cheaper.// |
| F1206 |
Yeah. |
| F1205 |
Yeah? |
| F1206 |
Yeah. |
| F1205 |
What about erm on weekend nights?
Have you noticed anything special about the way women dress
//maybe?// |
| F1206 |
//Er,//
the style is a little mm more smart, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
I think. |
| F1205 |
Mm. |
| F1206 |
Yeah.
But about also free time, er I notice that that is also a big difference.
Erm women er of the age about forty, fifty, they often go for a pub er to have a drink, and in Poland, it's not like that I think. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Still this er er this role of woman, it's traditional and they stay at home. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
They they can meet friends, but at home.
//That...// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
of course sometimes you can meet in a, a woman, [inaudible] er in a pub, but er here it's most popular.
//I think.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
What about erm the way people here look at religion, women, is it, is there something special about religion in Poland that you don't see here?
Any religion, really. |
| F1206 |
Yeah, that is a little er different here and something new for us, because we met another culture, another religion. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
er like Musl-Musul-, er Muslims. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Er so we don't know exactly very well, mm just a little, and we observe that.
But about Christianism, it's similar but I think people here, it's mm more honest.
If they go to a a church,
//they go. In Poland// |
| F1205 |
//Mm.// |
| F1206 |
very often they go because of nei-neighbours.
//What my neighbour will say?// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
So it's, I think it's better
//because they are honest.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
And if they practice they practice. If not, it's not only for a show
//for people.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
Has your life changed, er, your religious life here? Did you...? |
| F1206 |
No, the same. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
Yep. |
| F1205 |
Okay, maybe erm now about the general erm role in the society and the way women are treated by men,
er because they sometimes, European women sometimes comment that they're not let through the doors like they do in Europe.
//And// |
| F1206 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1205 |
maybe they er they don't get kisses on their hand
//when they greet. Have you noticed anything like that?// |
| F1206 |
//Mmhm.//
//Yeah of course, that is// |
| F1205 |
//[inaudible].// |
| F1206 |
the this gentlemen, er mm customs er
in Poland, er and mm I think it's very nice.
And here er relation between a boy and a girl is er more mm partner,
//so, yeah.// |
| F1205 |
//Mm.// |
| F1206 |
Mm. |
| F1205 |
Yeah? |
| F1206 |
Also er I think er here mm it's mm more freedom about the different er about guys and er mm relationships of the same er |
| M1207 |
Sex. |
| F1206 |
sex.
[laugh] Yes.
So er in Poland it's still strange and er in a town it's better but in a village er very often it's a problem. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
So society's more tol-tolerant here. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
I think also [?]a separate[/?] position, the, unofficial relatio-, partnerships |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
are treated here almost the same way like marriages, where in
//Poland if// |
| F1205 |
//Uh-huh.// |
| M1207 |
you are not married you have no rights as a couple. |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1205 |
Do you think women who are in er relationships which are not legal, in Poland they are looked at differently by maybe their neighbours
//[inaudible]? Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//That depends if it's in a village or in a town.// |
| M1207 |
//Ah ah.//
I was sort of thinking about how the state treats treats
//people who are in informal relationships.// |
| F1205 |
//Uh-huh uh-huh.//
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Here it's much better.// |
| M1207 |
//Here it's, er you've got in every form, you've got 'married' or 'living as married' and no one really care if you had a wedding or not.//
In Poland you have to have paper, stamped. |
| F1206 |
It's not easy in Poland, really complicated, because if you live in an unmarried couple, and er for example your boyfriend has an accident and is at hospital in Poland, even you can't visit him, |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
cause you are not er his family, so [exhale], that it's... here it's better, much better. |
| F1205 |
Mm right, er so how much do you think that your life has changed, the attitudes for instance, to equality? Does that, did you come to Glasgow with this attitude? |
| F1206 |
Of course, er each new place er mm chan- change people,
er and the new place it's also people, new experiences,
//so// |
| F1205 |
//Mm.// |
| F1206 |
er develops your personality, s-, I think, yeah, I've changed.
And er at the beginning it wasn't easy for me because of the language. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
And because new place, er new experience, it's the people. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| F1206 |
And even friends, that takes time to make
//friends.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
And now it's better, much better.
And er we can I hope make er profits from living here but also give something, that is the [inaudible] I think.
And it's really a gr-great experience.
Er we meet new people and new culture, we er mm visit Scotland, which is er really beautiful.
So yeah, that's er that create your personality,
//so it's a good experience, I think.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm.//
Fantastic. Erm, well the last question is about the Glasgow Women's Library.
Erm, have you, are you mm in a way a member of it, because I've learned about you through the Glasgow Women's Library, I got your contact details from them,
er from one of the teachers.
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
//Erm not yet, but I hope er in the future er we learned about er it a little on the internet, I heard something, I think it's a good idea,//
er because that help er women to develop and also it's a great information resource.
//So it's a great idea, I think.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
Do we have places like that in Poland at all? |
| F1206 |
Er it's new but er I heard something, yeah, we have in Poland there are gender studies, something like that. [CENSORED: forename] you heard something?
//Could you// |
| M1207 |
//Mmhm.// |
| F1206 |
explain that? |
| M1207 |
And they they are making some some research about women's role
//in in in the society.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
//Uh-huh.// |
| M1207 |
//So they are at the university and they are [inaudible].// |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
But also I saw on their website that the Glasgow Women's Library is also to help women with |
| F1205 |
Mmhm. |
| M1207 |
several problems.
And I think in Poland it's quite different because we've got plenty of organisations which are
//er [inaudible] focusing on the very narrow field.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
//There's not such a wide [?]street[/?] organisation. It's only created for one or two reasons, to help lonely mothers, or to help foreign women or to help//
//with drug problems or the human trafficking so they are always focusing on the very narrow field.// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
Do you think there are places in Poland where women can meet and be together? |
| F1206 |
Mm I think yes but I don't know personally. |
| F1205 |
Mmhm.
You can't think of any. Okay, that's
//fine, er...// |
| F1206 |
//Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
I think there's a church for the elderly women. |
| F1205 |
//Uh-huh ah yeah.// |
| F1206 |
//Church, I think, yeah.// |
| M1207 |
And also I've heard that it's er mm because in the, under the previous regime there was very [inaudible] cultural life in the villages,
//run by the state, like clubs or the// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm. Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
er how [inaudible] country housewives
//or whatever, and that's// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm, yeah.// |
| F1206 |
//Mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
all disappeared after the transformation, but now it's er, it comes back and it's the women who are responsible for re-re-reviving it,
//because it's just a good idea, and women need places to to meet// |
| F1205 |
//Mmhm mmhm.//
//Mmhm mmhm.// |
| M1207 |
//so after twenty years' gap they they restart the meetings of the societies or something.//
But that's only from the article I read recently. |
| F1205 |
Yeah, fantastic, I think that's it. I think we've finished. |
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